Continued from prior post:
Days of Future Past: Understanding the Prophesies of Daniel 9-12
And continuing related commentary on David Bernard's exposition:
Has Revelation Already Been Fulfilled? | Episode 104
While I generally with Dr. Bernard on some key points, I do not believe that preterism in general is wholly inconsistent with Apostolic Theology. While some preterists may make errors in their evaluation of scripture, we should be clear that preterism should be understood as a perspective or lens through which we can examine Bible prophesies to determine whether the predicted events have come to pass already or if they have yet to be fulfilled (futurist). Preterism should not be deemed a "doctrine", rather it is a means of interpretive approach.
Dogmatically asserting preterism MUST be the filter to interpret all prophetic texts produces just as much error as does the Futurist position that all prophesy applies not at ALL to the last 2000 years or more, but is for ours and future generations alone. WHOLESALE NT Preterism and Futurism can BOTH fail, each's proponents having to make many leaps and suppositions to find an unshifting foothold. Both camps produce a lot of strange teachings. By contrast, asserting that preterism can NEVER be used to understand prophesy is very short sighted and exposes an unrealistic bias that favors dogmatic ignorance over truthful inquiry.
Again, correctly understood and applied, Preterism and Futurism are BIASES, not doctrines, through which we evaluate scripture. As a rule, Revelation as a NEW TESTAMENT text should be evaluated BOTH preteristically AND futuristically in a balanced means of inquiry.
As outlined in my prior article, there is a VERY STRONG case to make for the the preterist reading of the OLD TESTAMENT book of Daniel chapters 9-12 which does NOT impact our traditional understanding of the eschatological timelines for future events given by Matthew, Thessalonians, and Revelation, nor does it undermine core Apostolic Theology in any way. The facts below are easily corroborated with most encyclopedias.
As a matter of brief overview:
Daniel 11:36 refers to Antiochus IV Epiphanes, of the Seleucid Empire.
Daniel 11:45 refers to the Greek Citadel called the Acra he erected in Jerusalem.
Daniel 12:11 refers to two events: 1) when Antiochus IV enters Jerusalem and outlawed animal sacrifice and other Jewish laws and customs, and then 1290 days later 2) when the Temple was "made desolate"
According to Josephus:
"In 167 BCE, Antiochus IV Epiphanes ordered an altar to Zeus erected in the Temple. He also, according to Josephus, "compelled Jews to dissolve the laws of the country, to keep their infants un-circumcised, and to sacrifice swine's flesh upon the altar; against which they all opposed themselves, and the most approved among them were put to death."
From Antiochus IV Epiphanes onward to the time of Roman Emperor Vespasian's control over Judea, there would be no sacrifices for sin performed in the jewish high temple.
(Daniel 9:25) says "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times." By the time of Christ, John 10:22-23 depicts Jesus present for the Hannukah remembrance at Solomon's Colonnade (porch)
Hannukah is celebrated by modern Jews in remembrance of the Maccabee's revolt against Antiochus, and their subsequent rededication of the temple. Judas Maccabee also rebuilt the walls as prophesied by Daniel 9:25.
So Daniel 9:25-26 takes us from the end of Antiochus' interference with the Jews around 167 BC, through the Maccabeean period (between the Old and New Testaments) to the time of the birth of Jesus Christ, and the Roman occupation.
In fact, in accordance with Daniel 9:26, Jerusalem, and the Temple were destroyed utterly in AD 70 by Roman Emperor Vespasian's son and general, Titus. Titus eventually became Caesar himself and took on the name Titus Caesar Vespasianus, after his father.
Josephus claims that because they were gathered for Passover, over 1.1 million jews were killed in Titus' Seige of Jerusalem (AD 70) and that "Titus and his soldiers celebrated victory upon their return to Rome by parading the Menorah and Table of the Bread of God's Presence through the streets."
Daniel 9:24 is interesting in that it seems to give a time frame during which certain things must occur which did actually occur:
1. To finish the transgression and make an end to sins. "The transgression" is Adam's sin, as in bring the sin of man to an end, also ending sacrifices for sins.
2. To make reconciliation for iniquity and bring in everlasting righteousness. This would be accomplished by the crucifixion of Jesus and subsequent resurrection.
3. To seal up the vision and prophesy. Meaning the words of Daniel are already fulfilled.
4. To anoint the most Holy. This does not mean the temple, but Jesus himself. Being anointed in life and in death by John for his ministry and by the women who anointed his body.
Daniel 12:1 most likely refers to the edict of Herod (Rachel’s Lamentation) to kill all the newborn children in Judea, and the soon coming of Christ the Deliverer.
(Daniel 12:2) refers to the many resurrections that happened in Jerusalem when He, Jesus Christ, was crucified. (Matthew 27:50-54).
(Daniel 9:24) speaks of 70 weeks. This is typically interpreted as "weeks of years" referring to the destruction of the Temple by Titus in AD 70.
(Daniel 9:26-27) speaks of the cutting off of the Messiah (crucifixion, end of the earthly ministry) and how subsequently Jerusalem and the Temple would be destroyed. It was in fact destroyed by the Romans and their "prince" (note Titus was the SON of Emperor Vespasian at the time, thus a "prince") and thus the final ending of potential jewish sacrifices and temple worship was complete.
We also see mention of Alexander the Great, and the division of Alexander's kingdom into the 4 subsequent dynasties (the Ptolemaic Kingdom of Egypt, the Seleucid Empire in the east, the Kingdom of Pergamon in Asia Minor, and Macedon) including the subsequent wars between these kingdoms. This history is well covered in Halley's Bible Handbook.
Personally I have avoided eschatology .I remember in the early 80s the ten toes were the European common market we now no that to be incorrect and the bar code was the mark of the beast.Ever changing escatology that often seems like science fiction makes for great cinema like the left behind series.
Please explain Matthew 24 in particular when it says (you) who is the ( you)?
I don't like preterism it leaves us with out a rode map for the future.
Some bible scholars contend The prophecy of Jesus failed' God forbid!'
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As a general disclaimer, I am not a universal preterist. I am of a mind, however that IF there is a strong case to be made which aligns Bible prophesy with actual historical events that occur following or contemporary with the text - they should be evaluated without applying confirmation bias that automatically assumes that all predicted eschatology applies to either our generation or future generations, and none at all of the past 20 centuries since Christ.
This sort of intellectual laziness can lead to all manner of strange and unbiblical time-wasting doctrines which could be easily avoided. We should not fear to examine scripture in the light of history, science, archaeology, or any other evidentiary discipline.
That being said, regarding Matthew 24, there is a strong case to be made for the preterist lens because Jesus does speak of "this generation" not as referring to an overall Epoch of the church age, but as in events which would occur during the lifetimes of those he was addressing.
Jesus cites Daniel which, as I've already outlined, was being fulfilled at that time and to us, looking back, is completed. History does record that the Christians fled to the surrounding countryside during the Seige of Jerusalem having been forewarned by Jesus. v21 uses a hyperbolic device used many other places in scripture.
Not all revelation can be read as fulfilled prophesy, but Revelation 12 (as connected to Daniel 9 and Matthew 24) certainly contains some events that are fulfilled in past to us, but were current/to come when written. If we accept the traditional date of Johannine authorship to be around AD 95-99, it helps us understand what we read as being either past, present, or predicate.
Remember contextually that John was writing this book, in his later years, from prison at at time when all the remaining disciples had been martyred. There was sound reason for him to write in a more allegorical style - one which would be understood by his church contemporaries but not as easily by his captors.
Let's break down Revelation 12
v 1-2 The woman clothed in 12 stars is Israel, about to birth the Messiah.
v3-4 Then we see Satan cast out of heaven ready to devour the child. This happened when Herod sent his edict to kill the firstborn
v5 speaks of the ministry and ascension of Christ
v6 speaks of Jewish Diaspora after the time of Christ
v7-9 Satan tries to get back into heaven but is defeated by Michael and the power of the blood.
v 10-12 Remember in Job how Satan would come into the throne room to accuse? No more. He was/is overcome by Jesus' blood.
v 13 Angered, Satan tries to destroy Israel (AD 70 temple and other persecutions)
v 14 refers again to Jewish diaspora, persecution, and satan's failure to obliterate them
v15 then, Satan shifts his focus to the church
Eusebius records 10 persecutions against the church from Tiberias to Diocletian until the Edict of Milan so it is quite possible that the early churches looked at this period as a time of great tribulation. Not only were the Jews under attack, but the church as well.
There have been 2000 years of history since Christ, most of which many people are ignorant of. Some of these prophesies were given to the church for that age for the purpose of helping them survive.
However, is there a case to be made for things prophesied and fulfilled which may ALSO be predicate for OUR time?
We do have examples of what I call a "Super-Prophesy" where an event is predicted, it happens, and as a real event it stands also as typologically predictive event which in and of itself either prophesies or helps us understand ANOTHER future event.
Some Cases are:
1. Abraham was promised a son, Isaac is born as foretold, then is told to execute him, etc as typology for Christ to come.
2. Noah is told about the flood, 8 are saved through water, typology for Christian Water Baptism explained in 1 Peter 3
many other examples exist... SO while some events can certainly be deemed to have occurred post Bible pre-today, they could have enhanced predictive value for our end times.
I understand your sentiment about not having as clear a future roadmap - but that is what should keep us seeking and operating in the gifts of the Spirit - especially prophesy. Remember that between the Old and New Testaments there is a 400 year period of prophetic silence and then an explosion of fulfilled prophesy. Same thing when the jews were in Egypt. 400 years of nothing and then the time of deliverance.
You don't have to understand it all. Just stay ready.